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Messages - chetbrz

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General Discussion / Re: 29 Plymouth Hubcaps
« on: February 11, 2017, 05:39:59 PM »

I am totally not sure at this point.  I know the 1928 had different caps so we can rule them out.  I seem to have 4 of each of the caps you are talking about.  The four without the octagon were originally on my car and the four with the octagon came from a purchase of 19" wheels from a 30U.  I also have 4 of the new style 30U caps.

I am totally confused at this point.  I know Walter P used items to depletion.  My 29U was manufactured early in 1929 probably no later than March so the round hubs might be correct for my car ???  Will take a peek at the production numbers ??

Another mystery ?  Chet...

General Discussion / Re: 29 Plymouth Hubcaps
« on: February 11, 2017, 10:51:18 AM »

The Master Parts list shows the following:
1928Q to US-GP725H Part Number 44816  Qty 4 per car.
1929U from US-GP725H to 30U 1558573 With wood wheels as Part# 311781 Qty 4 per car.

(Curious the description says "Wheel Hub Cap (front) (wood wheel) but shows Qty 4 and no alternate part number for a rear wheel before 30U SN: 1558573

After 30U 1558573

Front part number 322824 Qty 2 per car
Rear  part number 323830 Qty 2 per car

My guess is that they were all round after US Car GP725H and Canadian Built GP732D up to 30U 1558573 where the Master Parts List shows a different front #322824 and rear 323830

My 29 has on it now 3 round Hub caps without the hex wrench octagon shape.   Also I think the octagon shape hubcap came from some 30U wheels that I picked up a year or so ago.  (Never noted the cap difference) Since I used one of these hubcaps from the 30U I probably added the hex cap.  So this is why I probably have 3 round and one hex.

I hope this and other replies will nail the question down,  Chet...

General Discussion / Re: Some dimensional help needed.
« on: February 11, 2017, 10:22:13 AM »

Thanks John, I seem to be dead nuts at 52.5"

It looks like the templet is correct.  Will start on the actual sills today.  Weather permitting.

Thanks Chet...

General Discussion / Some dimensional help needed.
« on: February 10, 2017, 10:57:25 AM »
I have been working on a wood templet from which I will cut my new sill plates.  I have completed the template and I am now looking to confirm my work before cutting the hardwood for the Sills.  Since the Sill member is bolted to the frame in 7 places on both sides I am very confident that my measurements are dead on accurate.  As a quick check I was wondering if someone with a 29U 4 Door sedan could provide the following rear body section width measurement.

I am looking for a ballpark measurement as a check:  From the right bottom edge of the rear door support member steel cap, at the floor to the left side.  See pictures for clarity.  Both rear doors would have to be open so you can measure from outside edge to outside edge.


Many Thanks in Advance,  Chet...

General Discussion / Re: 29 Build Thread
« on: January 30, 2017, 10:51:18 PM »
Mortising in the sill covers into the floor so they are flush would seem to allow the sill plates to sit flat.  It seems like it would be better, and I have wondered about this.  But I do not think this was the case for my original floor boards, as I did not see any indication that they were mortised in.  But that was 43 years ago!

Great, Less work to do.  Anyway with the rubber mat in the front and rug in the rear, the cover thickness is a moot point.

Tks,  Chet...

General Discussion / Re: 29 Build Thread
« on: January 29, 2017, 10:28:41 PM »

If you need information on the curve of the sill wood, i have a new set of sill plates. The outer edge of the sill plates approximates the outer edge and curve of the outer wood edges.  If that would help, I could trace the sill plate edges and send to you.


Replacing the sill members on these old cars at age 16 is quite an undertaking.  Accomplishing the repair is even more impressive.   :)

Tracing the sill plate curve would be beneficial as a check.  I was planning on using the sill outer cover to create the curve once the sill member was in place with the cowl and rear section also correctly located.  I would then ensure the alignment of the doors and center door pillar is correct before I create the curved section of wood.  This curved section would be glued and screwed to the wood sill.  Since the metal support brackets need to be mortised into the sill, I would cover the top of the sill with a 1/4 inch finish wood with the mortised sections precut. 

Question,  I think you told me that the sill plates go over the sill cover.  If so.., is the sill cover flush with the floor.  If it is, I would have to route the edge of the sill member to allow the sill cover to finish at the exact height of the floor.   Considering that these bodies were made by companies that made wood coaches, this level of craftsmanship was probably employed ?

Your thoughts,  Chet...

General Discussion / Re: 29 Build Thread
« on: January 28, 2017, 09:03:49 PM »

The weather here in Delaware this week has granted me permission to forge ahead with my project.

I have not yet decided what type of wood or combination of wood I will use for the sill member.  Jeffrey made a good case for white oak.  I am thinking about treated deck board with a 1/4 inch of oak glued to the top surface.  I think durability might be more important then strength.  After all, if the board is properly bolted to the frame it could support more weight then I could put into the car. 

Anyway the link below gives the blow by blow on my progress recreating the left Hinge Pillar Assembly.


General Discussion / Re: Some dimensional help needed.
« on: January 26, 2017, 08:33:26 PM »
This is great info, Just what I was looking for.

Based on this information I can now accurately determine the location of the front and rear body sections and the exact location of the Door Pillar.  Also, I can now calculate the exact length of the sill member.   :)

Thanks,  Chet...

General Discussion / Some dimensional help needed.
« on: January 26, 2017, 04:38:47 PM »
Since nothing of my floor was original I am trying to piece together what was probably there.  The next couple of questions would be a big help.

Question 1:

How much gap is there between the rear body section and the gas tank bracket. 
Measured between the body and the top of the support bracket.

Question 2:  See picture..

Question 3:  It appears that the front section is equidistant from the end of the frame to the firewall.  My question is:  How much gap if any is between the firewall and the front fender assembly.  See picture below.

Many thanks in advance,  Chet...


General Discussion / Re: 29 Build Thread
« on: January 25, 2017, 08:17:56 PM »
Chet, just checked ebay its listed under   Tips on auto body woodwork by Don Marsh      $18.00   JG

Thanks Jeff, for the info.  I have a lot of literature on auto frame construction.  I am using 3/4" sections of Poplar (a closed-grain hardwood) glued together on opposing grain for strength.  For me, poplar is easily obtainable from my local lumber supplier.  A member 3" wide will be constructed from 4 planks of 3/4" wide material.  The sill will be made of two planks 3/4" thick with one plank on top and bottom of a 1/4" wide middle section.   Total width 1.750 inches.  The finished sections will be painted with weather protective stain prior to final assembly.   Anyway once my car is done the chances of it being deliberately left out in the rain are slim to none.  PS... I am also using premium exterior wood glue.  I agree that white oak is more durable but also is harder to shape and is more expensive.   I appreciate your input, all these comments keep me focused and honest.

Actually I haven't cast any of this in stone yet so I am open to any and all opinions.  Actually the original frame might have been pine maybe that's why not much of it is left.  The pieces that are left are grainy and extremely light in weight ?


General Discussion / Re: 29 Build Thread
« on: January 23, 2017, 12:14:32 PM »
Frame Project Update:

This update has two many pictures to add to this post so if you are interested please click on the link below to my online project diary.
( For you younger folks a diary is the same as a blog  :) )

General Discussion / Re: Running Board Matt/Rubber
« on: January 22, 2017, 10:08:43 PM »
That has been a mystery to me.  All I know is the vague picture in the instruction handbook.

Check,  I believe that is the 1/8" ribbed rubber matting.  Widely sold in many places.  Used this for the trunk liner on my 48 Ply.

This is just one of many links to floor mat companies.  Just need to decide on the pattern.

General Discussion / Re: Running Board Matt/Rubber
« on: January 21, 2017, 07:23:30 PM »

Thanks for the info, Do you know for sure what rubber matting would be used for the front seat area of the 29 4 door.
I believe rubber was in the front and carpet in the rear.


General Discussion / Re: 29 Build Thread
« on: January 18, 2017, 07:36:30 PM »
The Framing Issue:

With the front suspension completed and all 4 wheels supporting the car again I continued on the framing project.  First I stripped out the old floor to get an idea of the daunting task ahead of me.  I am very disappointed by the lack of original wood.  I was hoping that something of the sill assembly was left but to my disappointment none to be found.

Using the three frame mounting points on each side of the car (6 all together) I was able to determine my understanding of what the sill plate might have looked like.  The picture below is a rough idea and the following are my determinations.  If anyone has information other then this, please let me know.

1)  Sill plate thickness 1 3/4".  Length, width, and exact shape to be determined.
2)  Sill will be a single piece structure from front to back.
3)  Rear section support brace is secured with Lap Joints and through bolted to the frame. 
4)  The rear body section sits on 4 defined frame points which will square the back section and everything from that point forward will be measured from the back section as the reference.

The Plymouth frame construction appears to be simpler in nature then the Fisher Body which relies more on mortise joints.  the Plymouth frame utilizes metal braces at high stress connection points.  Also mortis joints are used in many places.

General Discussion / Re: Need Some Help
« on: January 17, 2017, 09:27:08 PM »
I can take some measurements when I get home (traveling now for work), but since my frame is slightly bent, not sure my measurements would be useful.


I think slightly bent is Par for the course.  I am trying to get mine as square as possible before I work on the wood framing.   It seems to me as the wood framing weakens the steel frame twists a bit.  Also as the leafs rust together the frame takes more unbalanced movement across the four support springs.  Just my theory.

Good luck with the business trip, Chet...

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